Elite: General talk
11 Dec 2020, 3:07pm
Still, I suspect that these limits are distant second in terms of "why hasn't this been done since?" The first reason is undoubtedly the unprecedented wave of ugly vitriol that spewed from the community after Salome died. Even Drew himself was turned off from the game for awhile.
11 Dec 2020, 3:15pm
11 Dec 2020, 3:21pm
Rebecca HailSakashiroRenraikuPG and Solo were tacked on to placate those that wanted an offline mode. They are legitimate modes, they are not the original vision.
If anything was "tacked on", it's the always-on requirement to ED's offline mode that was originally promised during crowdfunding.
That's not tacked on, that's a necessity due to how the game evolved.
Requirements change in development and that's one of them ^^
This is true and partly what I am saying, Prior to the promise of an offline mode the vision didn't include one.
You are right "tacked on" is the wrong terminology. My apologies.
11 Dec 2020, 3:22pm
EpisparhOh, yes PvP is always a salt mine in general case especially when the fairness factor is missing AKA no balance exist.
It is 100% fair that a paper-hulled Asp Explorer is at a combat disadvantage against a hunter-killer Fer de Lance.
11 Dec 2020, 3:29pm
EpisparhSorry, Ren, it is personal character - I am a very direct person.
As for the repeating - this is caused by repetition of the arguments. Not sure why this card is pulled always. The thing is done and gone.
This was not meant with malace. Not sure if you have noticed, but I have never commented on Drews work here.
My point is, we know your thoughts on the matter you have mentioned it several times before, I personally find it offensive that you use it as a tool to prove your point.
We all know instancing in Elite is an issue. PvP was most certainly in mind, probably the same attention was given to a proper option as was an offline mode. They took the cheaper option.
11 Dec 2020, 3:30pm
M. Lehman
It is 100% fair that a paper-hulled Asp Explorer is at a combat disadvantage against a hunter-killer Fer de Lance.
Not if you compare them in a race to Beagle - which can be considered also PvP as it is kind of racing scenario. But yes, fully engineered PvP meta beats in combat other builds given same skill level of users. This include also the scenario where you replace one of the meta component with fuel scoop for example. Same skill - one of the tools have better performance it wins.
All this is in 1vs1 scenario else larger and better equipped gank wins... again given same skill level.
11 Dec 2020, 3:38pm
EpisparhM. Lehman
It is 100% fair that a paper-hulled Asp Explorer is at a combat disadvantage against a hunter-killer Fer de Lance.
Not if you compare them in a race to Beagle - which can be considered also PvP as it is kind of racing scenario. But yes, fully engineered PvP meta beats in combat other builds given same skill level of users. This include also the scenario where you replace one of the meta component with fuel scoop for example. Same skill - one of the tools have better performance it wins.
All this is in 1vs1 scenario else larger and better equipped gank wins... again given same skill level.
I would make the case that part of being a skilled player is outfitting properly, and that "winning" at PvP isn't necessarily destroying another ship. An explorer who knows what he or she is doing will "win" by being able to escape an attacker.
11 Dec 2020, 4:13pm
M. Lehman
I would make the case that part of being a skilled player is outfitting properly, and that "winning" at PvP isn't necessarily destroying another ship. An explorer who knows what he or she is doing will "win" by being able to escape an attacker.
Yes, that is correct but then if I compare with my 800+MJ AspX to an AspX with 70MJ in a jumping distance race we know who will win. Still fairness is ones perception and the great dis-balance between PvP combat meta and everything else exist and is probably the source of all salt. It is not about if I have the required unlocks, mats and knowledge.
11 Dec 2020, 4:17pm
I was there when Marlinist event was a thing in Imperial space - and it was the last time I flew my Chieftain in open. I experienced myself the rivaling Chieftain that ignored the shield, fried my PowerPlant and it only went worse from there. When shield was down, FSD has been disabled right away at the second, third shot. If not the presence of another player in Wing that took focus from me, I'd be kissing a rebuy screen, because there was no way for me to respond to that, let alone escape. I left maybe with 3% hull after two ship repairs and managed to land on the station with maybe 3 seconds of oxygen left.
We're speaking about slightly engineered (Grades 2-3) Chieftain with presumably combat build that munches Elite Federal Corvettes without a single dent on the hull - and should be more than capable to fight away the another Chieftain. It was disabled under the minute - unable to return fire or even escape. Do explain me how is that even balanced?
Last edit: 11 Dec 2020, 4:31pm
11 Dec 2020, 4:25pm
Renraiku
This was not meant with malace. Not sure if you have noticed, but I have never commented on Drews work here.
My point is, we know your thoughts on the matter you have mentioned it several times before, I personally find it offensive that you use it as a tool to prove your point.
We all know instancing in Elite is an issue. PvP was most certainly in mind, probably the same attention was given to a proper option as was an offline mode. They took the cheaper option.
I clearly said that I do not think you had malicious intention. Nor did I as I have a great respect for Drew, but then the negative reviews exist. I didn't believe them before I bought the book but I find them a 100% accurate now after. You may had read it being biased by participating in something you consider great event while I had no such burden.
And for the last line I do agree they had few great plans in mind but implemented it poorly due to time/budget limitations as it is usual of how thing works with Software Development . And apparently there is no intention to change it or at least I haven't heard anything about it.
11 Dec 2020, 4:37pm
Vinh KruczekChieftain with Grades 2s and 3s on modules, like stated in the post above.
Pip management is your friend.
Situational assessment and awareness is also your friend.
11 Dec 2020, 4:41pm
11 Dec 2020, 5:25pm
EpisparhRenraiku
This was not meant with malace. Not sure if you have noticed, but I have never commented on Drews work here.
My point is, we know your thoughts on the matter you have mentioned it several times before, I personally find it offensive that you use it as a tool to prove your point.
We all know instancing in Elite is an issue. PvP was most certainly in mind, probably the same attention was given to a proper option as was an offline mode. They took the cheaper option.
I clearly said that I do not think you had malicious intention. Nor did I as I have a great respect for Drew, but then the negative reviews exist. I didn't believe them before I bought the book but I find them a 100% accurate now after. You may had read it being biased by participating in something you consider great event while I had no such burden.
And for the last line I do agree they had few great plans in mind but implemented it poorly due to time/budget limitations as it is usual of how thing works with Software Development . And apparently there is no intention to change it or at least I haven't heard anything about it.
I was not involved in the event. I have no bias, the context just didn't sit right with me.