Elite: Game talk

Worlock77
18 Jun 2018, 8:50pm
EdwardoAct of gross stupidity!!!!
I was playing last night and was getting tired. I must have dozed off as I clicked launch to leave a planetary base. I woke up just in time to see my A rated Cutter explode and ended up with a 38M credit insurance bill, two 100K plus fines and the loss of rep with two of my allied factions! I also had almost a million in bounty vouchers that have disappeared in to the ether.

Dozing off whilst pad loitering is NOT a good idea - that’s going to take a few delivery missions (or some skimmer missions) to get all those credits back - oh well, at least it wasn’t real money.

On the bright side, I have now found out that the insurance claim still preserves all of your materials AND my engineered enhancements - been collecting materials for ages.


Again? You gotta start getting a good night's sleep before attempting to embark out into the void.
Renraiku
19 Jun 2018, 1:11am
Brynhild Hervorsdottir
Phelbore
Brynhild HervorsdottirWait...

Phelbore
Brynhild HervorsdottirThe situation in Ling Deti and Cardea is a blessing in disguise, because you can match influence with the appropriate factions to grab the last assets in those system on the way back to the top






If you own everything in a system and get locked down you have no services, no stations to turn in bounties to fix it.





That's incorrect, recent personal experience has shown that Contacts, especially for bounties, and Universal Cartographics remain open during a Lockdown. Mission Boards and Outfitting definitely not. My memory is hazy on Shipyards though. Lockdowns certainly limit your options but do not leave you completely helpless to retaliate.




I stand corrected then, but my point still stands, it's still crippling.



It is if you have a group that sits on their hands and says "Oh noes, my faction is in lockdown!"


Sitting on your hands has nothing to do with it, any BgS manipulator worth their salt knows about transaction caps and their limits, especially the limitations a Lockdown has on maximising transactions.
User78245
19 Jun 2018, 4:03am
Renraiku
Brynhild Hervorsdottir
Phelbore
Brynhild HervorsdottirWait...

Phelbore
Brynhild HervorsdottirThe situation in Ling Deti and Cardea is a blessing in disguise, because you can match influence with the appropriate factions to grab the last assets in those system on the way back to the top







If you own everything in a system and get locked down you have no services, no stations to turn in bounties to fix it.






That's incorrect, recent personal experience has shown that Contacts, especially for bounties, and Universal Cartographics remain open during a Lockdown. Mission Boards and Outfitting definitely not. My memory is hazy on Shipyards though. Lockdowns certainly limit your options but do not leave you completely helpless to retaliate.





I stand corrected then, but my point still stands, it's still crippling.




It is if you have a group that sits on their hands and says "Oh noes, my faction is in lockdown!"



Sitting on your hands has nothing to do with it, any BgS manipulator worth their salt knows about transaction caps and their limits, especially the limitations a Lockdown has on maximising transactions.


I've personally observed differently.
Renraiku
19 Jun 2018, 4:18am
Brynhild Hervorsdottir I've personally observed differently.


Care to elaborate on the circumstances? Can you quantify what was done to counter the Lockdown in comparison to what was done to support it?

Last edit: 19 Jun 2018, 4:35am
Phelbore
19 Jun 2018, 4:18am
Brynhild Hervorsdottir I've personally observed differently.


I cut out a bunch of the back and forth so a single reply doesn't take the entire page. Care to give an example?
Stryker Aune
19 Jun 2018, 4:27am
Phelbore
Brynhild Hervorsdottir I've personally observed differently.



I cut out a bunch of the back and forth so a single reply doesn't take the entire page. Care to give an example?


I'm wondering the same thing.

Care to share?
Phelbore
19 Jun 2018, 5:21am
While you are right that 5.5% in a day for a 5.2 billion pop system isn't bad, you're also correct that if other stations are owned it's a fairly bad example.  We have only your word that operations were conducted only out of locked down stations, it is not widely known.  Also, that's quite a lot of data and vouchers dropped for such a gain.  Surely you have to agree though that the amount of data and vouchers dropped would have been far less had you been able to run missions as well.  I'd wager getting enough high inf missions to have the same swing would take far less time than gathering 1200ly of exploration data and 20 million in bounty vouchers.

Edit: Also, I have to ask... were the bounty hunters running pure energy weapons? If not, were they going to stations without lockdown to rearm/repair?
User78245
19 Jun 2018, 5:45am
I think it took me a little less time to run out to the Coalsack Nebula via Pratchett's Disk and whatever that other station is out there than would've taken me to board hop for and complete 15 inf+++++ missions. You just need to jump-honk through the system, credit value of the data has no bearing on the influence gains. I know people who just stockpile data for weeks on end specifically for BGS operations, I was just the odd one out having to go fetch it. Would it have been beneficial to be able to do missions as well? Yes it would have, but this demonstrates that should your ambitions lie toward controlling all of the stations in a few systems, then your faction is not completely helpless to retaliate.
Phelbore
19 Jun 2018, 5:54am
Brynhild HervorsdottirI think it took me a little less time to run out to the Coalsack Nebula via Pratchett's Disk and whatever that other station is out there than would've taken me to board hop for and complete 15 inf+++++ missions. You just need to jump-honk through the system, credit value of the data has no bearing on the influence gains. I know people who just stockpile data for weeks on end specifically for BGS operations, I was just the odd one out having to go fetch it. Would it have been beneficial to be able to do missions as well? Yes it would have, but this demonstrates that should your ambitions lie toward controlling all of the stations in a few systems, then your faction is not completely helpless to retaliate.


Why would you go for 15 +5 inf? The advice I've heard is that only 10 inf per player is the most that has an effect, so that'd be far quicker to gain. Also, I have been informed by people I consider quite reliable in the field of BGS work, that in addition to transactions, there is a certain minimum limit that must be met for a transaction to count. If it's not met, it'll simply add to the value of the next item turned in and so on until one of the minimums is reached, then that'll count for a single transaction. That would seem to imply that jump-honk-jump is not the most efficient way to go. Whether all that is true or not, it was never said that you'd be completely helpless (well, ok, I did say that, but admitted I was wrong). The point was that it is rather crippling and you haven't done much to dispel that notion.
User1355
19 Jun 2018, 6:03am
PhelboreThe advice I've heard is that only 10 inf per player is the most that has an effect


10+'s will hit the max gain only if no other activity opposes yours.

If you expect opposition, then increase the target by all means, especially in high-population systems.

Interesting discussion though. It confirms what I said earlier about bounty claims and explo data being the only ways to alleviate lockdown in a system completely owned by the locked-down faction - good to see the theory works in practice!

Personally I would rather keep a station or two in another faction's hands to keep a mission board and my options open, but I am but a simple BgS vandal and not an empire-builder
Phelbore
19 Jun 2018, 6:08am
Brynhild Hervorsdottir
   As for your edit, I don't know the nuts and bolts of their personal flying experience, but if I were in the same position and used kinetics for weapons, I'd have resupplied at the stations not locked down and conducted influence transactions at the locked down stations. Or I'd have jumped to a nearby system to resupply, one with a station close to the primary, and then handled transactions at the expected lockdown station. If I have the patience to single click exploration data and bounty transactions, I have the patience to make an extra logistics stop.



I believe what brought this whole conversation on was the idea of owning every station in every system you're in.  Since expansion happens to the nearest system without 6 factions in it (or is it 7?) in the original scenario there will be no nearby stations to rearm at, which would surely lower the efficiency significantly.

Marra Morgan
PhelboreThe advice I've heard is that only 10 inf per player is the most that has an effect



10+'s will hit the max gain only if no other activity opposes yours.

If you expect opposition, then increase the target by all means, especially in high-population systems.


True, but the scenario presented does say opposition has ceased.
User78245
19 Jun 2018, 6:33am
PhelboreI believe what brought this whole conversation on was the idea of owning every station in every system you're in.  Since expansion happens to the nearest system without 6 factions in it (or is it 7?) in the original scenario there will be no nearby stations to rearm at, which would surely lower the efficiency significantly.

Marra Morgan
PhelboreThe advice I've heard is that only 10 inf per player is the most that has an effect




10+'s will hit the max gain only if no other activity opposes yours.

If you expect opposition, then increase the target by all means, especially in high-population systems.



True, but the scenario presented does say opposition has ceased.


1. I wouldn't necessarily resupply at "my" stations, since resupply transactions have no bearing on influence, so I would find whatever neutral station is convenient and operational if "my" stations were not. Also, you can expand into a system with 6 factions, that happened a couple months ago in Orrere.

2. Opposition was assumed to be ceased, given that it would've taken away from the opposition to another operation in [REDACTED] where we were also applying pressure. If there was any opposition, it was token or not nearly as robust as what we were observing in [REDACTED]. We weren't in any mood to budge an inch in [ALSO REDACTED], hence the overwhelming response. Since both sides were hostile to each other, there was no communication and the only indications of any opposing effort would've been from the system bounty board or the traffic report in what was normally a high traffic system.

Last edit: 19 Jun 2018, 7:08am
Phelbore
19 Jun 2018, 2:57pm
Brynhild Hervorsdottir
PhelboreI believe what brought this whole conversation on was the idea of owning every station in every system you're in.  Since expansion happens to the nearest system without 6 factions in it (or is it 7?) in the original scenario there will be no nearby stations to rearm at, which would surely lower the efficiency significantly.

Marra Morgan
PhelboreThe advice I've heard is that only 10 inf per player is the most that has an effect





10+'s will hit the max gain only if no other activity opposes yours.

If you expect opposition, then increase the target by all means, especially in high-population systems.




True, but the scenario presented does say opposition has ceased.



1. I wouldn't necessarily resupply at "my" stations, since resupply transactions have no bearing on influence, so I would find whatever neutral station is convenient and operational if "my" stations were not. Also, you can expand into a system with 6 factions, that happened a couple months ago in Orrere.

2. Opposition was assumed to be ceased, given that it would've taken away from the opposition to another operation in [REDACTED] where we were also applying pressure. If there was any opposition, it was token or not nearly as robust as what we were observing in [REDACTED]. We weren't in any mood to budge an inch in [ALSO REDACTED], hence the overwhelming response. Since both sides were hostile to each other, there was no communication and the only indications of any opposing effort would've been from the system bounty board or the traffic report in what was normally a high traffic system.


1: Having to make several jumps out of the system (assuming the assaulted system isn't on the edge) just to re-arm would significantly hinder the ability to end lockdown, to the point I would call it crippling.

2: Fair enough, it's very rare to have a stupid enough enemy that they tell you what they're doing.
User23543
19 Jun 2018, 4:55pm
I’d just like to point out no one is saying factions that control every port are helpless.  They just face a significantly tougher hill to climb than those that don’t require total supremacy.

Before we even talk about Lockdowns, I’m thinking of the amount of work needed to acquire every asset in a system.  Absolutely doesn’t seem worth it with how hard that can screw you down the line.  

In the end, I think it’s well supported leaving at least one port uncontrolled is wise.
R0S3GU4RD5399
19 Jun 2018, 9:43pm
Hey guys does anyone know of any good money runs to do right now that are quick and repetitive? Also anyone know a good federation rep farm?

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