Elite: Game talk

Thinder
29 Sep 2023, 5:41am
Sampi Ogonek
madamepestilence@ pretty much everyone here - I'm mainly just looking for the absolute furthest jump distance I can get while also having a small cargo bay, basic defenses, and keep my ability to fuel from stars


Then I suggest you open a few tabs of EDSY and experiment with various loadouts.

Here’s an example of a not-quite-optimal-but-sufficient-for-my-needs loadout I’ve been using for exploration semi-recently. (The fuel scoop is a legacy engineered module I’ve never got around to replacing.)


It's a good idea but ultimately it is up to each individual to figure out what they need, and many times it will take some experiment:

I just increased the 6D Thrusters Dirty Modification from Grade 2 to Grade 3 (Drag Drives Experimental Effect) and got the opposite of what I expected (reduction in Jump range), it increased slightly to 71.26LY and Boost speed to 486M/S which was what I wanted. this of course in empty configuration (Full tank) Maximums.

For the sort of mission I intend to carry over (once trained as Fuel Rat, right now, I'm just a recruit) I don't think there is another ship coming close to it, of course like every engineered fit it is a compromised, but it is the beauty of the game, it allows each player to customize their ship according to their need and play style.

>>>

On a negative note, I don't think my Stocks are selling, my Carrier is in Rodentia, perhaps the wrong spot, perhaps the wrong Stocks, but it's still early days, so wait and see.

Last edit: 29 Sep 2023, 8:12am
U-303
29 Sep 2023, 9:30am
hi,

How strange... after having recounted here my difficulties in mining the rings of the planets now that it is starting to work again and that I no longer have time to play it at length; everything seems to have returned to normal... I finally manage to sell the ores for hundreds of millions while from August to September I found no more at all.

then problem solved; but without changing anything in my method... chance does things well ^^
Sampi Ogonek
29 Sep 2023, 1:03pm
Thinder
Sampi Ogonek
madamepestilence@ pretty much everyone here - I'm mainly just looking for the absolute furthest jump distance I can get while also having a small cargo bay, basic defenses, and keep my ability to fuel from stars


Then I suggest you open a few tabs of EDSY and experiment with various loadouts.

Here’s an example of a not-quite-optimal-but-sufficient-for-my-needs loadout I’ve been using for exploration semi-recently. (The fuel scoop is a legacy engineered module I’ve never got around to replacing.)


It's a good idea but ultimately it is up to each individual to figure out what they need, and many times it will take some experiment:

I just increased the 6D Thrusters Dirty Modification from Grade 2 to Grade 3 (Drag Drives Experimental Effect) and got the opposite of what I expected (reduction in Jump range), it increased slightly to 71.26LY and Boost speed to 486M/S which was what I wanted. this of course in empty configuration (Full tank) Maximums.

Umm. Neither Dirty Tuning nor Drag Drives change the mass of the thrusters, so they have zero effect on jump range.

If you have observed a slight increase of your jump range, then either your fuel tank is not as full as it was before (the most likely explanation), or you changed something else and forgot about that, or (unlikely) there is a bug in the game.
Bainsey7
29 Sep 2023, 2:22pm
Sampi Ogonek
Thinder
Sampi Ogonek

Then I suggest you open a few tabs of EDSY and experiment with various loadouts.

Here’s an example of a not-quite-optimal-but-sufficient-for-my-needs loadout I’ve been using for exploration semi-recently. (The fuel scoop is a legacy engineered module I’ve never got around to replacing.)



It's a good idea but ultimately it is up to each individual to figure out what they need, and many times it will take some experiment:


I just increased the 6D Thrusters Dirty Modification from Grade 2 to Grade 3 (Drag Drives Experimental Effect) and got the opposite of what I expected (reduction in Jump range), it increased slightly to 71.26LY and Boost speed to 486M/S which was what I wanted. this of course in empty configuration (Full tank) Maximums.


Umm. Neither Dirty Tuning nor Drag Drives change the mass of the thrusters, so they have zero effect on jump range.

If you have observed a slight increase of your jump range, then either your fuel tank is not as full as it was before (the most likely explanation), or you changed something else and forgot about that, or (unlikely) there is a bug in the game.




Both dirty drives AND drag drives increase mass. It says so on this very site:


https://inara.cz/elite/blueprint/4/

https://inara.cz/elite/blueprint/6/
Thinder
29 Sep 2023, 2:37pm


Correction it doesn't seem to be the exact same same configuration, I don't know what makes the difference but the Jump range haven't increased but the Speed/Boost Speed did, the mass remain the same at 16 T.

With a stock 6D the Maximum Jump range in this configuration is 71.26 LY.



Last edit: 29 Sep 2023, 2:48pm
Thinder
29 Sep 2023, 7:26pm
ClawsOfTiamatI have found that jump range becomes less important for an explorer build once you get far enough out of the Bubble, especially if you have a fleet carrier or go vertically on the galactic plane rather than horizontally. If you have the meta explorer build jump range, you will notice after a while that you see the same names over and over on discovery tags. This is because the game's algorithm pushes you to the same stars as other commanders with similar ranges. Once you get about 1,000 ly out, having a lower jump range actually enables you to find more first discoveries, because you are literally (because of the algorithm) going where no commander has gone before. Of course, without a carrier, you do have to weigh whether you want to do 1,000 lys worth of jumps to get out of the bubble. By Elite Dangerous standards, that isnt really that far, and even if you have a build with a mega jump range, you can always change the route parameters to give you shorter jumps or even do it manually with the Gal Map. Hell, even inside 1,000 ly out, manually targeting stars on the vertical plane will give you more variation, and more first discoveries. Thats my .02 credits anyway. But I'm just a silly old Belter, so what do I know?


It's either the game algorithm pushing or your own choice, make up your mind...

Last edit: 29 Sep 2023, 7:47pm
Kasumi Goto
29 Sep 2023, 7:57pm
I’ve found plenty of undiscovered systems with a (effectively) 68 ly jump range Phantom, so I would argue it’s less about the range or an ‘algorithm’, as it is about where and how you choose to explore. Stray off the beaten paths and/or galactic plane and it won’t take you long. I recently even found unmapped biological signals in a hand-placed system with a HD designator(IRL catalogued G type giant, if memory serves), less than 2k ly from the Bubble.

(Though the system itself has of course been diacovered and largely mapped, as in planetary body surface scans, prior to my arrival.)
Sampi Ogonek
29 Sep 2023, 9:19pm
Bainsey7 Both dirty drives AND drag drives increase mass. It says so on this very site:

https://inara.cz/elite/blueprint/4/

https://inara.cz/elite/blueprint/6/

No, they don’t. It says so on the very pages you’ve linked above

Clean and Dirty Tuning blueprints decrease optimal mass, which is utterly irrelevant to jump range.

The only blueprint that increases thrusters’ mass is Strengthening (a.k.a. Reinforced), and the only exp.effect that does so is Thermal Spread.
Kasumi Goto
29 Sep 2023, 10:24pm
ClawsOfTiamatYou can def find undiscovered systems using a meta jump-build. I did it forever, across two accounts. Once I started manually entering shorter jumps when a sufficient way out of the bubble, I had much more success though. Thats all I was saying.

Fair enough, I don’t doubt that. I personally just prefer following a route to a point I selected somewhere, without going a direct route to a known POI - or that I am aware of - and up/down a certain distance in the galactic plane.

Sometimes stop there to explore a local cluster, or shorter ‘routes’ if I spot something interesting in the realistic galmap view - discovered an unfound, procedurally generated F type supergiant some distance below plane in the Elysian Shore just before U16 dropped, that way. And a few black holes in/around the center.
Thinder
29 Sep 2023, 10:52pm
Kasumi GotoI’ve found plenty of undiscovered systems with a (effectively) 68 ly jump range Phantom, so I would argue it’s less about the range or an ‘algorithm’, as it is about where and how you choose to explore.


Exactly. There are sectors where players don't go simply because not only it is too far for them, but also because the Carrier routers simply doesn't have the data to compute a route, which says a lot about those sector level of exploration, even with a jump range of 500 LY I manage to pile up firsts...

I had to compute the routes manually, and it lead me to vertical levels of the map which turned out to be dead ends because there weren't any possible way but to U-turn and go back, once the Carrier in cool down I would take the Krait, visit the neighbouring systems, honk them and when of interest, scan them and the planet surfaces.

Bainsey7
29 Sep 2023, 11:23pm
Sampi Ogonek
Bainsey7 Both dirty drives AND drag drives increase mass. It says so on this very site:

https://inara.cz/elite/blueprint/4/

https://inara.cz/elite/blueprint/6/


No, they don’t. It says so on the very pages you’ve linked above

Clean and Dirty Tuning blueprints decrease optimal mass, which is utterly irrelevant to jump range.

The only blueprint that increases thrusters’ mass is Strengthening (a.k.a. Reinforced), and the only exp.effect that does so is Thermal Spread.


For a G5 dirty drives

THRUSTERS - DIRTY - GRADE 5 ︎︎︎︎︎
MODIFIERS
POWER DRAW
+12%
INTEGRITY
-15%
OPTIMAL MASS
-13%
OPTIMAL MULTIPLIER
+40%
THERMAL LOAD
+60%

As far as I know, the optimal multiplier being +40% increases the thruster's ability but the optimal MASS -13% decreases jump range. That's why it's in red (which I can't copy/paste to show here). Similar for clean drives.
Thinder
29 Sep 2023, 11:50pm
Bainsey7
Sampi Ogonek[quote=Bainsey7] Both dirty drives AND drag drives increase mass. It says so on this very site:

https://inara.cz/elite/blueprint/4/

https://inara.cz/elite/blueprint/6/



No, they don’t. It says so on the very pages you’ve linked above

Clean and Dirty Tuning blueprints decrease optimal mass, which is utterly irrelevant to jump range.

The only blueprint that increases thrusters’ mass is Strengthening (a.k.a. Reinforced), and the only exp.effect that does so is Thermal Spread.


There is something that doesn't add up, the mass of your ship taken into account plays against the jump range and this includes the modules, and mine being on the light side doesn't influence the Max Jump Range because stock or engineered I have the same 71.26 LY range, Optimal Mass is 999.0...

As you can see, the Max Jump range is identical whether you fit a stock module or mine, so the factor has to be something else than the engineering.




I have 71.26 LY Jump Range for both engineered and stock thrusters, they both weight 16T.
madamepestilence (PS4 Red Light of Death)
30 Sep 2023, 12:04am
oh heos what arguments have i started lmao
Sampi Ogonek
30 Sep 2023, 12:36am
Bainsey7
Sampi Ogonek
Bainsey7 Both dirty drives AND drag drives increase mass. It says so on this very site:

https://inara.cz/elite/blueprint/4/

https://inara.cz/elite/blueprint/6/


No, they don’t. It says so on the very pages you’ve linked above

Clean and Dirty Tuning blueprints decrease optimal mass, which is utterly irrelevant to jump range.

The only blueprint that increases thrusters’ mass is Strengthening (a.k.a. Reinforced), and the only exp.effect that does so is Thermal Spread.


For a G5 dirty drives

THRUSTERS - DIRTY - GRADE 5 ︎︎︎︎︎
MODIFIERS
POWER DRAW
+12%
INTEGRITY
-15%
OPTIMAL MASS
-13%
OPTIMAL MULTIPLIER
+40%
THERMAL LOAD
+60%

As far as I know, the optimal multiplier being +40% increases the thruster's ability but the optimal MASS -13% decreases jump range. That's why it's in red (which I can't copy/paste to show here). Similar for clean drives.

Note that is says OPTIMAL MASS, not MASS. Those are completely different things.

Optimal mass is a variable of the performance curves (see here). It has nothing to do with the mass of the thrusters themselves.

EDIT: In hope of dispelling the confusion: the variable that affects jump range is called optimised mass, and is a property of the FSD. The optimal mass of thrusters is something completely different, and the optimal mass of a shield generator is something different from both of those.

Last edit: 30 Sep 2023, 1:03am
madamepestilence (PS4 Red Light of Death)
30 Sep 2023, 2:16am
Welp, Lonely Courier II [Type-9 Heavy Space Trucking Ship] renamed to Lonely Courier III after blueray-10_ decided to kill me in Deciat for some reason lmfao

Literally did not set me back at all, I was able to afford the insurance with much to spare and still got my FSD Engineering1 intact, so I'm not really sure what the point of that was

Like ??? That's one of the few humans I've run into in months, and they randomly blew me up? When there was no hostility? And I was already engineered? I'll never understand why people do that

1Why did you bring a fucken T9 to Farseer?

I forgot to pin the engineering blueprint and had to fly there manually, and didn't really care about switching to my Scanwinder just to pin a blueprint

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