Elite: Lore
15 Mar 2020, 7:34pm
His assessment is heavy handed, but John is right. The Empire is not the beacon of humanity. There is rot. A lot of rot. Not just from Patreus, but from a lot of the ruling class.
Now I would have, at one point, argued that Emperor Arissa Lavigny-Duval is not a law and order zealot. However, ever since the ending of the Nova Imperium it's been difficult not to see that, at least a little. Aisling is a spoiled brat who found a niche white-knight cause to flaunt (several of those in the present, so I see it in the future as well), and uses that to social engineer. Granny Torval is a slave driver and has been slapped several times by the ISA (and the ISA has been slapped by the Chapterhouse) for not making sure slaves are treated properly. Patreus? Yeah, I'd call him the real zealot, in for power and pound. There's enough out there that I don't need to continue with him.
It's well known that Jubs and Patty don't get along.
I'm a staunch defender of the Imperial people, and a defender of the Imperial indentured servitude ("slavery") ). I love the Empire and I believe in the Emperor.
But, I'd be a terrible Inquisitor if I didn't see the rot and corruption in front of me. If I can't see it, how can I fix it?
In all of this, I seek the truth, and above that, remember.
15 Mar 2020, 7:36pm
John MontagSounds like everyone but the emperor and senators is a slave.
If that's how you want to look at it. I myself think that the Imperials at large are a very honorable people living by a codex that's apparently not very well understood by outsiders (read: Feds
)15 Mar 2020, 7:37pm
Amata LireinIf that's how you want to look at it. I myself think that the Imperials at large are a very honorable people living by a codex that's apparently not very well understood by outsiders (read: Feds )
Oh, you sweet summer child
15 Mar 2020, 7:44pm
Jubei HimuraAlright time for the Chapterhouse Inquisitor (former, if we're talkin' current RP story) to chime in.
His assessment is heavy handed, but John is right. The Empire is not the beacon of humanity. There is rot. A lot of rot. Not just from Patreus, but from a lot of the ruling class.
Now I would have, at one point, argued that Emperor Arissa Lavigny-Duval is not a law and order zealot. However, ever since the ending of the Nova Imperium it's been difficult not to see that, at least a little. Aisling is a spoiled brat who found a niche white-knight cause to flaunt (several of those in the present, so I see it in the future as well), and uses that to social engineer. Granny Torval is a slave driver and has been slapped several times by the ISA (and the ISA has been slapped by the Chapterhouse) for not making sure slaves are treated properly. Patreus? Yeah, I'd call him the real zealot, in for power and pound. There's enough out there that I don't need to continue with him.
It's well known that Jubs and Patty don't get along.
I'm a staunch defender of the Imperial people, and a defender of the Imperial indentured servitude ("slavery" ). I love the Empire and I believe in the Emperor.
But, I'd be a terrible Inquisitor if I didn't see the rot and corruption in front of me. If I can't see it, how can I fix it?
In all of this, I seek the truth, and above that, remember.
Yes, like I said before: The top two castes are the ones that put shame to the Empire. But claiming that this rot is representing those below the senators (patrons, clients and citizens) as well and saying they too are mistreating slaves and are only faking their dignitas is just wrong. It's like saying that all those living in poverty in the Federation are not just trying or working hard enough to makes ends meet, especially when these people are already working three jobs and still can barely scrape by.
15 Mar 2020, 7:48pm
Amata LireinIf that's how you want to look at it. I myself think that the Imperials at large are a very honorable people living by a codex that's apparently not very well understood by outsiders (read: Feds )
It's a well known fact that the high Imperials base their honour around name, fortune, and reputation (very much like the Lords and Ladies of jolly old Europe).
Common Imperials also look at those types of honour, but may also look at real honour (based on deed and action) a little more.
There are a small smattering of groups in Imperial space the base everything on real honour, based on deed and action.
My character comes from a warrior clan based in Shinigami. Real honour means everything there.
15 Mar 2020, 7:51pm
Amata LireinYes, like I said before: The top two castes are the ones that put shame to the Empire. But claiming that this rot is representing those below the senators (patrons, clients and citizens) as well and saying they too are mistreating slaves and are only faking their dignitas is just wrong. It's like saying that all those living in poverty in the Federation are not just trying or working hard enough to makes ends meet, especially when these people are already working three jobs and still can barely scrape by.
Since they won't, or can't, do anything about it the lower castes share the shame as well.
15 Mar 2020, 7:52pm
Take this from one who has tried early on. Now, we just rib each other pretty good.
15 Mar 2020, 7:52pm
Jubei HimuraAmata LireinIf that's how you want to look at it. I myself think that the Imperials at large are a very honorable people living by a codex that's apparently not very well understood by outsiders (read: Feds )
It's a well known fact that the high Imperials base their honour around name, fortune, and reputation (very much like the Lords and Ladies of jolly old Europe).
Common Imperials also look at those types of honour, but may also look at real honour (based on deed and action) a little more.
There are a small smattering of groups in Imperial space the base everything on real honour, based on deed and action.
My character comes from a warrior clan based in Shinigami. Real honour means everything there.
Wasn't that basically what I was saying, at least when it comes down to "how to treat your slaves"?
15 Mar 2020, 7:55pm
Jubei HimuraAlso, no matter what, you will not convince people outside the Empire of anything. You are wasting your energy trying to do otherwise.
Take this from one who has tried early on. Now, we just rib each other pretty good.
Yeah, it's like being an European and trying to convince a conservative American that "social democracy" is not "socialism"... but this would lead to a discussion that will open a can of worms we don't want in here, so I just leave it at that and move on
15 Mar 2020, 8:00pm
Jubei HimuraAlso, no matter what, you will not convince people outside the Empire of anything. You are wasting your energy trying to do otherwise.
Take this from one who has tried early on. Now, we just rib each other pretty good.
I'll pillock my own in-game views for the moment.
My current character is from Lave and used to work for the Alliance as a mercenary. After losing the war with Lave Radio Network and the system leaving the Alliance he self exiled in shame.
Being not just a member of Pilots Federation but also of Elite combat rank he is, without qualification, a total monster. In fact, every PF member should get a super skeptical eye from everyone with half a brain.
But that's the fun part - role playing someone I would never be in real life.
15 Mar 2020, 8:09pm
Jubei HimuraAlso, no matter what, you will not convince people outside the Empire of anything. You are wasting your energy trying to do otherwise.
Take this from one who has tried early on. Now, we just rib each other pretty good.
He tried more than once. Never stood a chance.
15 Mar 2020, 8:11pm
15 Mar 2020, 8:20pm
JellicoeWe have cast iron lore that slaves are not always treated well be senior imperials, Premonition begins with a massacre of slaves who are protesting that their rights as *Imperial* slaves are not being respected, and while their slaughter is regarded as going too far it is not at all illegal (it is also carried out by a senator and relative of the Duval family itself so not a minor, tin pot figure), then we have the short story Blood is Thicker* from the Tales from the Frontier anthology which again features Imperial slaves being worked to death. Now such treatment of slaves might be frowned upon by Imperial society but it clearly is something that happens.
I have not claimed otherwise. I even pointed out that senators, knowing very well that they are above the law, abuse that power. That was not the issue being discussed here, but how the ordinary Imperial citizen is treating Imperial slaves. And the mere fact that the ISA even exists should be proof that the general public is adhearing to the rules and regulations layed out.
15 Mar 2020, 8:32pm
Amata LireinAnd the mere fact that the ISA even exists should be proof that the general public is adhearing to the rules and regulations layed out.
That fact means nothing. Existence of an authority doesn't equal that authority doing its job.