Offtopic

Rawnu
13 Nov 2024, 9:15am
Aleksander Majjam
That DLC was amazing! It's sad that the old Bioware we know and love, isn't the same from yesteryear. I don't have any decent hope for the next ME. Unfortunately.


If Dragon Age: Veilguard is any yardstick for ME5, it's probably going to be aggressively fine. Fine. Just that. Not bad, not excellent, just fine. Which is probably the best we can hope for. I just want to get back into the world of ME, see some Krogans again, shoot stuff up and maybe even pilot a ship like the Normandy (ok, that last bit is probably too much).
Rayman.
13 Nov 2024, 10:17am
i liked tempest in me4. Can we have something similar in ED?
Aleksander Majjam
16 Nov 2024, 8:07am
Rawnu
Aleksander Majjam
That DLC was amazing! It's sad that the old Bioware we know and love, isn't the same from yesteryear. I don't have any decent hope for the next ME. Unfortunately.



If Dragon Age: Veilguard is any yardstick for ME5, it's probably going to be aggressively fine. Fine. Just that. Not bad, not excellent, just fine. Which is probably the best we can hope for. I just want to get back into the world of ME, see some Krogans again, shoot stuff up and maybe even pilot a ship like the Normandy (ok, that last bit is probably too much).


Your thoughts on Andromeda?

Also, Veilguard wasn't a bad game. To me, it was a bad DA game. Had it been anything other than DA, I probably would've been more than whelmed.
Rawnu
16 Nov 2024, 8:18am
Aleksander Majjam
Your thoughts on Andromeda?


I played Andromeda years after its initial release, so all the bugs had been ironed out... and I enjoyed it. It has by far the best gameplay mechanics of all ME games. The setting was interesting, the Tempest was a great home base. It was just lacking in that "ME magic" department. I was expecting more "alienness" in Andromeda and somehow it then just ended. Andromeda is a prime example of a game that would have desperately needed one or two DLCs to iron out the shortcomings storywise.
Kasumi Goto
16 Nov 2024, 2:35pm
I don’t know whether I should be amused, shake my head in disappointment or both. Because this is clearly what we play games for, right? (Seriously, why did people actually ask for this?)

And, that aside, I have some thoughts of my own regarding Andromeda. The main story with the (supposedly) long-dead alien species and the “Scourge” (was that what they called it again?) was alright, I suppose, and combat was ok too, but I did not like the finicky “cover” system which some genius decided to try doing differently for reasons instead of sticking with the tried and true of “Push button and character enters cover”… sometimes when I put my character into it they’d literally walk themselves out of it without any input of my own. And no, it was not controller stick drift.

Also no weapons on player vehicle, because …? God forbid you can defend yourself if a giant native monster happens to try making you its lunch. Open “world” was also the typical, full of random stuff/filler that often has no importance to lore or world building, but at least there were some decent side quests.

I think the main story would have been better off with just the “Remnant” (I forgot if they were given any other name) and why they were just gone, instead of shoving some idiots that have highly advanced genetic engineering, but somehow don’t use it to fix their reproductive problems and instead snatch other species’ members and turn them into their own, in. Which is a personal issue that I have with them as opposed to the other fact I’ve seen mentioned, that their motivations were about as shallow as grabbing power over one of Andromeda’s satellite galaxies(?). And some moron’s obsession with ancient alien tech. I cared so little I even had to spend a few minutes before I recalled their name.

I’d spend serious time rewriting those guys if they are even being considered as getting brought in for the next Mass Effect. But… yeah, I think it’d be better off without people snatching gene stealers to whom it doesn’t occur they could be fixing their problems without literally making themselves the enemy of everybody else in the/a galaxy.
Emily Valefor
yesterday, 11:31pm
Hey I'd like to ask fellow elite dangerous fans about a game suggestion. We are eager to check out jumpship coming out soon (which if you've not seen please look it up I imagine many will enjoy it.) But at present we are trying to avoid complete elite dangerous burnout while looking for a co op scifi or fantasy experience. I'm looking for something more chill since I'm knee deep in a heavy development cycle, and brain power is at a low bar. Are there games around that might be worth our while?

Further info:
- We already played monhun to death (thousands of hours since mhfu)
- We're not keen on Baulders gate 3 and the divinity series
- We are looking for a game we can have repeat progression on per session.
- Right now the game team is doing Sea Of Thieves night and we do a tall tale, so we're looking for a game that's more for the two of us to peel away from being social for a bit.
- If it's on ps5 so much the better, my pc is my work station so getting to get up from my office would be sweet but sometimes pc is the only way

Thank you for reading, have fun out in the black
Aleksander Majjam
today, 4:55am
Rawnu
Aleksander Majjam
Your thoughts on Andromeda?



I played Andromeda years after its initial release, so all the bugs had been ironed out... and I enjoyed it. It has by far the best gameplay mechanics of all ME games. The setting was interesting, the Tempest was a great home base. It was just lacking in that "ME magic" department. I was expecting more "alienness" in Andromeda and somehow it then just ended. Andromeda is a prime example of a game that would have desperately needed one or two DLCs to iron out the shortcomings storywise.


Kasumi GotoI don’t know whether I should be amused, shake my head in disappointment or both. Because this is clearly what we play games for, right? (Seriously, why did people actually ask for this?)

And, that aside, I have some thoughts of my own regarding Andromeda. The main story with the (supposedly) long-dead alien species and the “Scourge” (was that what they called it again?) was alright, I suppose, and combat was ok too, but I did not like the finicky “cover” system which some genius decided to try doing differently for reasons instead of sticking with the tried and true of “Push button and character enters cover”… sometimes when I put my character into it they’d literally walk themselves out of it without any input of my own. And no, it was not controller stick drift.

Also no weapons on player vehicle, because …? God forbid you can defend yourself if a giant native monster happens to try making you its lunch. Open “world” was also the typical, full of random stuff/filler that often has no importance to lore or world building, but at least there were some decent side quests.

I think the main story would have been better off with just the “Remnant” (I forgot if they were given any other name) and why they were just gone, instead of shoving some idiots that have highly advanced genetic engineering, but somehow don’t use it to fix their reproductive problems and instead snatch other species’ members and turn them into their own, in. Which is a personal issue that I have with them as opposed to the other fact I’ve seen mentioned, that their motivations were about as shallow as grabbing power over one of Andromeda’s satellite galaxies(?). And some moron’s obsession with ancient alien tech. I cared so little I even had to spend a few minutes before I recalled their name.

I’d spend serious time rewriting those guys if they are even being considered as getting brought in for the next Mass Effect. But… yeah, I think it’d be better off without people snatching gene stealers to whom it doesn’t occur they could be fixing their problems without literally making themselves the enemy of everybody else in the/a galaxy.


Ultimately, I didn't care much of Andromeda's story or their characters. It didn't help that I played it Day 1 and it was nothing but a shit show. Raw, I know you said you came in later, post patches, but this video is one of the best highlighting ME:A's early days.



Kas, it sounds like you had deeper issues with the game, lol. I'm in your corner when it comes to your points. As a guy that loves RPG's, I need to care about the story. Even more, I need to care about the characters. ME 1-3, I cared about both. It can't be overstated that the level of writing in those games was superb. M E3 is considered the weakest in the series, yet it could hold its own against ME:A in any category you want to put against it. I'm sorry, but I don't have any faith in Bioware's current writers. Bioware used to be at the front of the line concerning storytelling and writing, but they have long since been kicked down the ladder as far as CDPR and Larion. I might sound like a broken record echoing the praise for BG3, but I swear, every choice I made in that game over the 200 hours I put in it felt like it mattered. I don't think the characters were as compelling as early Bioware characters, but the storytelling was top notch.

It's been 3 years since the ME 4 trailer released, and it's been radio silence since then. I can only hope that this came doesn't fall into development hell, or fall into the trope of "running it back" with familiar storylines / characters.
Aleksander Majjam
today, 4:58am
Emily ValeforHey I'd like to ask fellow elite dangerous fans about a game suggestion. We are eager to check out jumpship coming out soon (which if you've not seen please look it up I imagine many will enjoy it.) But at present we are trying to avoid complete elite dangerous burnout while looking for a co op scifi or fantasy experience. I'm looking for something more chill since I'm knee deep in a heavy development cycle, and brain power is at a low bar. Are there games around that might be worth our while?

Further info:
- We already played monhun to death (thousands of hours since mhfu)
- We're not keen on Baulders gate 3 and the divinity series
- We are looking for a game we can have repeat progression on per session.
- Right now the game team is doing Sea Of Thieves night and we do a tall tale, so we're looking for a game that's more for the two of us to peel away from being social for a bit.
- If it's on ps5 so much the better, my pc is my work station so getting to get up from my office would be sweet but sometimes pc is the only way

Thank you for reading, have fun out in the black


Give No Man's Sky a go. It's been quite a long while since I've played it, but MP back then was a bit of a chore to link up with others, but it might be much easier these days to find each other. Just need to get past the tutorial section I believe.
Kasumi Goto
today, 6:53am
Aleksander MajjamKas, it sounds like you had deeper issues with the game, lol. I'm in your corner when it comes to your points. As a guy that loves RPG's, I need to care about the story. Even more, I need to care about the characters.


In a way, you could say. (Unintentional rhyme)

I also only played MEA a few years after its release when it was brought to my attention that the Legendary Collection was a thing that existed (for better or for worse), while I had some interest in picking up Mass Effect, and so I went ahead and got that. After getting through its story [trilogy], I inquired about Andromeda, not having heard much positive about it somewhere... because it's the internet. I was told that it was at least in a largely playable state but to not expect much from its open "world" since it merely contained lots of generally irrelevant filler activities (the only one that I can remember which wasn't entirely was that... AI memory reconstruction thingy), and only focus on the things I was interested in. Alas, I made the experience anyway because my brain's completionist urges have a tendency to kick in at inopportune moments. Were I to play it a second time (which is rather uncertain)... I probably would largely ignore those nonsensical filler tasks worthy of a Ubisoft title (but it's EA so not too far off).

But anyway... I won't go into the things I already mentioned because of reasons, but yeah, the characters... I can barely even remember their names. Not very memorable... maybe that Angara's personal story/quest had some decent moments? Also not sure what his name was again, Jaal? Maybe, something like that. Definitely plays a large role for me as well to have an investment in them.

Ryder twins? Uhh... yeah. I don't know. I think that's all I can say. About them, anyway. Says a lot I was more interested in some of the characters introduced in side quests that actually had some good motivations to what they were doing, than the ones you're exposed to throughout the main story. Like the one with the Krogan(s), which was an interesting callback to the originals without feeling too intrusive or in your face. Of course, I chose to let them have the Remnant drive core because you don't want Krogans to be angry at you. And their leader seemed reasonable enough...

I also shoved one into the whatever-it-was-called's face by electing to have said Krogan form part of their council, at the end.


It also speaks volumes of its own that the world and remains/background of a (presumably) dead species, and the cause of their demise, was more interesting than any of the living ones, not to mention tie-ins with the past were more interesting than most of the new, though I guess the Angara (to capitalize or not to capitalize... that is the question) have potential. Those morons turning everything into their species because they're morons, though, just dump them in the bin. Who is going to miss them? Certainly not me.

... I'm also not exactly fond of just skipping almost seven centuries ahead in time. Sure, some story items have potential, but then you end up having to ask yourself, how are they going to tie it in with the new Mass Effect. And speaking of.

Aleksander MajjamIt's been 3 years since the ME 4 trailer released, and it's been radio silence since then. I can only hope that this came doesn't fall into development hell, or fall into the trope of "running it back" with familiar storylines / characters.

I think they did drop one additional trailer between then and now, plus a couple pictures (one of which showed an Angara, if memory serves), but it was not exactly that much more conclusive. If anything it just... added more confusion. I thought I overheard some tidbit or speculation from someone that covers the subject (among others like Dragon Age, which I don't play), but can't remember exactly what they said or thought.

As for the characters - while I certainly agree that they should not focus too heavily on the old, given how under-represented some of them were in ME3, I'd be rather disappointed if they were just shoved aside entirely, like, Kasumi had a few minutes of screen time in 3 (a few more counting Citadel) and nearly got blown up by a crazed hanar indoctrinated by the Reapers. I'm sure things like that were in part due to the rushed development cycle which it went through, but it still means I would not exactly be too happy if most of the other characters' stories were just ended off-screen and detailed in some text or audio logs or recounted by... whoever. And most of them would not live a few centuries into the future - only ones I could imagine are Grunt, Wrex (maybe, not sure how old that tough bastard is by 3) and Liara - unless they went into cryo for some reason.

Of course, my bias lies with a certain thief who seems to like tight body suits. As you might guess by, you know, the profile (nick)name... though I would not mind me some Garrus either. Just saying. But especially Kasumi I don't see being willing to enter into stasis unless absolutely necessary for any particular chance to stay alive. And even then...

... but yeah, they shouldn't recycle too many of the old(er) story tropes that were already covered. Like, the trailer basically confirms to us the geth are - in some form - still alive, but the focus should really, ideally be on how they and quarians cooperate moving forward. And just leave the Reapers as their legacy, maybe a brief callback to that. I guess they have 'Leviathan' to play with as a story tool now, which will be curious on how they might - or might not - involve them, since those things kind of view themselves as superior to, basically everybody else. (And of course the obvious thing is to not rely overly on Shep, but for god's sake don't pull a Halo 5, that travesty of a game will remain a mark on my memory for as long as it can remember such things.)

I also don't know how they plan on reuniting Andromeda with the rest without involving a major time skip that glosses over an actually interesting phase of the post-Reaper galaxy - namely, the rebuilding, or maybe a few years into it, which I'd be fine with - but to say I'm a little skeptical about it is... an understatement. Sure, some people are absolutely adamant that they should just dump everything old and go a few centuries ahead, but I'm feeling like that's a great way to turn people off. Because that is what MEA tried and look how that turned out (plus the other issues which plagued it, unrelated to story and its execution/characters).
Rawnu
today, 7:08am
The big issue with ME is probably BioWare itself. It's no CDPR, where the real interesting stuff regarding RPG storytelling is happening. And it's not just "capabilities", it's also determination. Just look at the amazing story of Cyberpunk 2077, a game so full ambition that fell flat on its nose on release day, only to came back over the following two years, culminating in an absolutely mind-blowing DLC, Phantom Liberty. The game itself was always good at its core (mechanics, story, characters, world-building), that was clear even in the beginning. It was just a big mess. And CDPR cleared it up, expanded on it, and added depth and nuance that it still blows my mind away. But with determination to get it right, regardless how hard seems, this wouldn't have happened. Just see how BioWare didn't care to make ME:A a really good game after its botched release, just a playable game. Another studio that I admire with my whole heart, and this is cliché, is FromSoft. Yes, it's an acquired choice, but if you love frustration and dense atmosphere (and a fundamental sadness to the world), their games are unbeatable (pun intended). Should they ever attempt to translate their gaming philosophy in a sci-fi setting, they get all the money they want from me. But that's basically it: do you understand, as a developer, what makes you and your games special? Then double down on it, build on your strengths. And if things go wrong, don't abandon it, throw your resources into it because that is what builds a legacy and player goodwill. And now we're back at the beginning: BioWare...

Last edit: 18 Nov 2024, 7:24am
Kasumi Goto
today, 7:18am
Well, in any case, if the next ME turns out as being not so good or distinctly average, maybe we can look at this instead which is said to be made by the original Bioware Mass Effect team (or something of the sort, I haven't looked closely) -



... this is also the same person I referenced above in my post/text wall somewhere. Just forgot to include this and a general channel link... probably because I should be asleep for a good few hours already.
Rebecca Hail
today, 3:18pm
Ah, the good old ME: Andromeda discussion again? I see, I see.

Don't worry, Aleks, noone blames you for not enjoying Andromeda.

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