Elite roleplay: Q&A and OOC

Synthya Wylder
29 May 2020, 10:51pm
Nerys Nymei
Synthya Wylder
A question re: Synthya's "native" language, since until the point where she learns 'Standard' or whatever's considered as the common/universal spoken language in E:D, should I (as the writer):

1. Continue with her using Trigedesleng, as she has been doing so far?



Kigon skrab daun trigedasleng, Heda!
Synthya Wylder
(The issue there is, very few if any actually knows/understands what she's saying, LOL)



Ai mema klin!
...but maybe for all the aulana a translation should be provided... and the actual language used only for short passages: otherwise it becomes hard to read and harder to write!


The extra work in writing, no doubt! For that passage in Synthya's Bio, it took me many hours over several days, hopping back & forth between several web resources, & frequent use of my notepad & text editor. =o

I'll await further input from others to (hopefully) derive a consensus.
Jubei Himura
30 May 2020, 3:09am
Hazzstig05so ive seen some recurring names pop up and damn you guys are good at this, any tips to writing something like you guys?


Creamy, Synthya, and Amata (I mean, she's Imperial so I expect no less) all have great advice.

If you will allow me to give some from the old guard of RP'rs and writers (all advice given to me from much better people):

- Being Mr./Ms SuperCool McBadass may feel cool, but honesty makes for a very boring read. Make sure your character is human and has some relatable flaws. Some have alcoholism, some have mental health issues, some have family issues. You get the point. Characters that lose and rise back up from losing are far more interesting. You'll notice that (if you read my stories), Jubs can't seem to catch a break - loses his natural eyes, beaten by a friend in a fight, losses his temper often, and get fired. ...and I've made him to be space-Wolverine (minus the claws and healing, come to think of it, Logan never really catches a break either).

- Never, NEVER, NEVER try to incorporate another universe/game's lore into your stories. Or, if you really can't (RE: won't) avoid it, learn the E:D lore enough to find equivalents. For instance... someone tried to RP a Pip-Boy from Fallout... in E:D we have arm/wrist computers. This person could have just written "His arm computer was of a crude and ancient design, functioned with the same holo-screens as current ones. It was clearly a stylistic choice." and it would have worked fine. Seriously, there are always ways to write things and get your point across in a lore-friendly way.

- Another no-no is making up races that haven't been mentioned in current cannon. There are two current _known_ races in E:D - Human, and Thargoid. There are also known human cyborgs, and humans with cybernetic enhancements (they may be shunned in certain societies). As far as we know, all AI androids were eradicated in an unnamed war in the past

- Sure, there can be genetic experimentation... but that's got a 10% chance of flying unless you make it convincing with appropriate consequences from the galactic society.


I really hope this helps some people.

Also, just in case you need, I run the Elite:Lore discord. We have a good place where you can lookup the lore, and theory-craft possible avenues for things that are not explained properly. Please click the link below if you wish to join (link cleared by Artie):

https://discord.gg/9CxySW2

Last edit: 30 May 2020, 6:48am
LordPsymon
30 May 2020, 4:06am
Also, no space pandas.
Synthya Wylder
30 May 2020, 4:19am
Thanks, Jubei for the positive mention!

I agree with the 'making your character believably hew-mon', with all the foibles, flaws, weakness & shades of grey that go along with the species. None of us are perfect, & some even complete klutzes. So your character should be too; relatable to the reader. "Hey, Creamy really has a thang for Nerys; not only does she seem intelligent, but she also sounds hawt. I'd wanna do her too." etc. & the other half of my Bi side might think, "Creamy, that charmingly oversexed scoundrel", & he's got a poignancy to him in that he struggles not to let Nerys know how he really feels about her. I can feel that. "I bet he'd be a helluva date at a party." Just examples of thoughts I have when reading their RP.

I don't mean to highlight their RP specifically other than to point out more recent examples.

Last edit: 30 May 2020, 4:29am
Synthya Wylder
30 May 2020, 4:26am
LordPsymonAlso, no space pandas.


"What?!? Did you space a panda?!? First a polar bear, & now a panda..." <look of horror comes across her face>
Isaiah Evanson
30 May 2020, 5:37am
It's fine to use your own personality as a basis for your character, just make sure you don't let it keep them from taking on a life of their own. This usually applies to characters that have been around for a while. Using mine as an example, he's been around since 2015 and has definitely seen some shit. He started off like IRL me, but as time has gone on there's a definite difference in the way he is and the way I am. 

Make sure you give them room to grow and consider how the events that happen to them will shape them, and don't be afraid to let events shape them too.
A C Ender
30 May 2020, 12:32pm
Synthya WylderA question re: Synthya's "native" language, since until the point where she learns 'Standard' or whatever's considered as the common/universal spoken language in E:D, should I (as the writer):

1. Continue with her using Trigedesleng, as she has been doing so far? (The issue there is, very few if any actually knows/understands what she's saying, LOL)

2. Offer 'translations' in English under/with her spoken Trigedesleng in some manner?

3. Use something like italics, colors, or some special punctuation marks to denote her speaking in Trigedesleng while I write in English, without my going to the extent of actually working up passages/responses in Trigedesleng?

I'm open to your thoughts & suggestions. It's about to become key.


I think it depends on what you want to convey in the story. Though I've not looked into the lore to confirm this, I find it highly likely that the universal language in ED have English at its core. This is because the USA took over after the third world war and founded what would later become the Federation, the first and at the time only power (Imperials were formed by a colony breaking of from the federation, and turned into the second power). With these things considered, while it may not strictly be English, it should be the root to what we speak now. Does Synthya knew English? If so she may understand some of what they say around her.

Since what she spoke were rare already, I would consider it highly likely that none speak it now. Had a particular language taken over and become widespread, that should have been very obvious in the lore. With that in mind, think about what you want to convey in a certain story, and who's viewpoint we are looking from. If we see from Syntyas point, she would either understand nothing, or limited, depending if she know English, but her thoughts and speak would be understandable (to her) even though we (as a reader) don't know it. From that viewpoint, you could go with something like;

Synthya frowned and strained her hearing. She saw the mans lips move, but the sound which came out made no sense. She saw him gesture towards a cup, but she had no idea what he said. Was he offering her whatever was in it? She nodded and extended her hand toward the cup, hoping she had guessed right. Her throat was really dry and she could use something to drink!

If you write from a third person perspective, you can choose who we as a reader would understand. Either none, one, or even both, even though they don't understand eachother. Unless you specifically want (most) of the readers to not understand Synthya but some to do, there is no reason you need to put in the hours of extra work to write in a rare but exist language when she speaks. It's either gibberish for the reader or the other side of the conversation, so it doesn't explicitly need to be written.

That's my view anyway.
Hazzstig05
30 May 2020, 1:02pm
I play DnD a bit so I have a tiny bit of RP experience, so once I get writing my own logs, hopefully I’ll join in with the big leagues haha
Michael Wolfe
30 May 2020, 3:19pm
Solid advice from Jubs.

And yeah, those of us who have been around for awhile have seen our share of bizarre RP. We've seen pandas, Warhammer-style Space Dwarves, and sentient dolphins piloting water-filled spaceships. We've had discussions about the appropriateness of colored dialogue text (most of us regard it as an unnecessary crutch at best).  We've had creepers who take sudden and persistent interest in any poster with a female avatar. We've seen blatant plagiarism and heavy-handed takeovers of other people's characters.

All in all, though, the RP remains more or less consistent. Probably the most difficult aspect of it is that it's difficult to craft into a self-contained story and not a forced conversation with no end in sight, especially if you don't know what others will say and do. It's the main reason why I myself never invested too much into roleplay and wrote more conventional stories instead.

Last edit: 30 May 2020, 3:32pm
Synthya Wylder
30 May 2020, 5:36pm
Regarding what M. Lehman posted, I generally agree, on the point of enjoying writing more than RPing. However, I can do it, & think that in some situations both can be combined.

A C Ender, it seems evident to me that neither have you actually read Synthya's Bio, which sets the basic premise of her character nor have you followed & read what RPs I've posted so far.

If I had to give a 1-word response it would be, "Wut?"

If each word cost money, I don't think in this case, it was well-spent.

The only thing of value I've gotten here is the (unofficial) opinion that English is the 'Galactic Standard' language of communication, albeit, affected by the genre & venue in the E:D universe.

To save you the time & effort of going back & reading what I mentioned above of Synthya's situation, let me try to explain in a simplified fashion.

1. Synthya understands & speaks a language which I think is plausible (based on Trigedasleng, a 'ConLang' specifically constructed for "The 100" series after what tends to happen after generations living in isolation: a form of 'devolving' or 'devolution' or 'mutation' takes place in the spoken word since it is passed down verbally, despite being taught with reference to the written language. Written language, on the other hand, being rather immutable, tends to evolve/devolve much more slowly. That element will shortly be revealed in the story.

2. From Synthya's point of view, she's in her early 20s. From the Universe's point of view, she's hundreds of years old, if not older. A general figure has yet to be determined & revealed in the story.

3. The RP is, at least so far, been written in "Third-Person", although I may decide to switch to "First-Person" at certain points. Although what she spoke in that passage in her Bio was based on Trigedasleng, it's not essential to the reader to understand it, as the gist of it was explained just prior to what she spoke.

The essence of my question was & remains, in what form should a translation be (if any), & I regret any confusion on your part in case English is not your native tongue.

With all due respect, Thank you for your input & indulgence.
A C Ender
30 May 2020, 6:45pm
Synthya Wylder A C Ender, it seems evident to me that neither have you actually read Synthya's Bio, which sets the basic premise of her character nor have you followed & read what RPs I've posted so far.

I actually have read your bio, and unless I missed something, all your RP posts too. Your last one I even commented that I enjoyed reading, and said I just wish you would post more often!

Synthya Wylder
1. Synthya understands & speaks a language which I think is plausible (based on Trigedasleng, a 'ConLang' specifically constructed for "The 100" series after what tends to happen after generations living in isolation: a form of 'devolving' or 'devolution' or 'mutation' takes place in the spoken word since it is passed down verbally, despite being taught with reference to the written language. Written language, on the other hand, being rather immutable, tends to evolve/devolve much more slowly. That element will shortly be revealed in the story.

The essence of my question was & remains, in what form should a translation be (if any), & I regret any confusion on your part in case English is not your native tongue.

With all due respect, Thank you for your input & indulgence.


English is not my native language, but I believe I got a good grasp on the language, and I'm currently living and working in UK for several years with no issues. If Trigedasleng is a commonly used term and generally accepted and understood by everyone, it's not a term I've ever come across so far. Thank you for explaining what it is. That said, I do think the rest of my original post covered what translation (if any) should be in your posts.

My key points were this:

1) Do you want the reader to understand what she's saying and thinking? If you write anything in first person, then the reader would be in the mind of Synthya, and though her words would sound different to what we as a reader speak, we would understand her fully. In a first person perspective, I think it's not time well spent for you to spend hours researching how to write certain things in Trigedasleng.

2) Is it important that the reader understand the sound of what Synthya is saying? This only apply in third person, where you could, if you want, write in Trigedasleng. My point was that unless the exact sound is important, you can easily get around the point that none, reader included, need to understand what she's saying. To an observer, she's speaking gibberish.

With those two points in mind, my view is that it depend on what you want to convey in that particular post. From my standpoint, I don't think the sound of what I say is important in most situations, so in most situations I would not write explicitly what I say. If the reader doesn't understand what is said, I see no need to spell out what isn't understood. Once Synthya realise that none around her understand what she say, she will have to try to use alternate means to communicate, and those actions and behaviours is how I would see a reader get to understand what she means too.

So in essence, I don't think there need to be any translation at all, and I don't think you even need to write out her words in Trigedasleng. Naturally you can, but I don't think it add much to the immersion.

Synthya WylderIf each word cost money, I don't think in this case, it was well-spent.


I think communication and discussion is always time well spent. If you got a message you think is worthwhile, I think it's always worth trying to convey it. It's only if after several attempts no understanding can be found that the communication start to be pointless.
A C Ender
30 May 2020, 7:02pm
My first post today was on phone, and I wasn't able to look for any sources at the time, but made an assumption on what I knew from the lore. Being on the PC now, I think that the sources support my assumption, and Federation Diction is the universal language in Elite Dangerous. From that source, it's stated that;

Since the 20th century, English remains the dominant language of international business and global communication through the influence of global media. In 2016, 395 million people spoke English as their first language, and 1 billion spoke it as a secondary language. However, English was not the only language used in global organizations such as the United Nations, and before World War III, Mandarin Chinese and Spanish each had more speakers.

Due to globalization many smaller languages and dialects fell out of use as its speakers died out or shifted to speaking another language. Thus many became extinct languages.

At the end of World War III in 2055, the United States of the Americas dominated Earth. The last remaining countries later joined the newly formed Federation. While the corporations rebuilt human civilization, the Federation diction became the primary language of Earth. Over centuries, it spread across countless star systems as humans colonized the galaxy.

In 3304 CE, the Federation is the oldest and largest of the three major factions. Thus the Federation diction is most commonly used. People in the Empire speak with a quirky accent derived from the Federation diction.


It's clear that English was the dominant but not only language -before- WW3. This indicates that -after- WW3 English had more speakers, and United States of Americas took over. This to me indicates that the Federation Diction have its roots primarily in English.
Synthya Wylder
30 May 2020, 7:24pm
Thank you, A C. I appreciate your thoughts on the matter.

I just find it difficult to reconcile your prior post https://inara.cz/board/1184/334514/#334514 with the latter https://inara.cz/board/1184/334565/#334565 . I got the distinct impression from what you wrote in the former that you had little if any clue as to either Synthya's background, or her storyline in RP.

I'll attribute that to differences in language-related concepts.

I wanted to include her Trig language to add an additional dimension & depth to both her character & story, & to underline in a way her situation, that of feeling rather like a 'Stranger In A Strange Land'.

That, & such a population on a Generation ship is to one degree or another, a somewhat alien civilization, each unique due to its isolation & divergent development over generations.

Take, for example, the story of the Generation ship Golconda (Spoiler Alert to those who wish to explore this themselves personally!)

Last edit: 30 May 2020, 8:05pm
A C Ender
30 May 2020, 8:09pm
The first half of my first hald (1.5 paragraphs) is essentially me thinking Synthya speak a completely different (and rare) language, not one that evolved from the common one. Blame that on my ignorance about what Trigedasleng was. That said, my comment about "english" might still apply regarding the Federation Diction. I suppose that's up to you to figure out just how far the language have morphed to be understandable on any level for her, written or spoken.

The second half was me trying to ask what you wanted the reader to experience, and what made sense for me in different situations. I wasn't trying to point to any of your past posts and apply it to them specifically, but be general in what I think make sense for how you wanted to approach the subject. What viewpoint it is written from (can vary from post to post or even within a post), and what you want the reader to feel/experience reading it. Maybe I didn't get this across well, I was on my phone with limited time, so weren't able read through my own text to check that it made sense. Hence the lack of source on the official language too.

Great book btw. Not my favorite ('Rendezvous with Rama' probably my top one), but great still.
Synthya Wylder
30 May 2020, 8:25pm
Something that I do wish to point out that is 1 of the criteria for higher-level IQ determination is the ability to think "outside the box", as in, to be able to entertain new concepts & ideas, rather than to simply dismiss &/ deny them.

On that note, I would welcome those who don't generally write RPs (specifically, here in Inara) to not consider themselves or act like "Chat or Lore Police".

Putting it colloquially, "Shit or get off the pot." Perhaps, Artie might consider attaching the moniker of 'LoreCop' to the ID tags of all those who feel the need.

I do note that Drew Wagar, 1 of E:D's most prominent & professional writers, stated that he's ended his E:D-based/focused novels, precisely due to the FDevs failure/lack of Lore support or development, in that between the inconsistencies & restrictions, he's moved on to writing things in a similar venue, with the freedom of being able to further develop them outside of what seems to this point, esp after the suspension of GalNet, a dead & static storyline.

I was moved & inspired to post this by a certain other member whose identity shall remain classified.

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