Elite: Game talk

Mac4
04 Oct 2022, 10:06pm
By the way,

Mac4to get back on this e-breach on controller issue, yes it turns out it uses the secondary action button B, which if holding it down is required brings up a sub-menu if you do so. That's really dumb.

I looked into rebinding it but ofc it's needed for a host of other things, so that's hardly workable. Strangely I don't readily find mention of it or a solution on the web, you'd think all those console players would run into it.


It struck me later that of course Odyssey has never been out on console. Boy, are all those kids in for a surprise

Last edit: 05 Oct 2022, 11:59am
Kurakil
05 Oct 2022, 12:05am
Mac4Note btw if you are wanted you can get shot down in an Apex shuttle just as well, I do believe and so it has been recently reported here. (Though it wouldn't cost you your ship, presumably?) I didn't know about your notoriety wearing off, so that sounds like a safe bet. If a lousy solution, of course.

I was shot down in a shuttle after leaving a surface settlement. I'm not sure if it was just because I was wanted or if it was because I had some notoriety. All I did was make room for a new set of npcs to move in... though it was a military settlement with three ships flying overhead. They can be so touchy sometimes.
Sir-Duke
05 Oct 2022, 4:57am
Uiil? Goid fighters - are Salvation mods better than regular Guardian weapons for anti xeno ?

There is no Guardian weapon "better" then the usual Gauss Cannon.
The common Gauss Cannon is the standard weapon of Xeno Combat, and a very good weapon until now.

But some Salvation modded weapons are very good, too.
And if you struggle with some flying skills, then maybe the modified Plasma Charger or maybe the modified Shard Cannons can help you.

Keep in mind, you need to have a Mbooni permit, to get Salvation weapons.
If you don't have the permit, then there is no way right now, to unlock it at the moment.
Episparh
05 Oct 2022, 5:01am
Uiil? Goid fighters - are Salvation mods better than regular Guardian weapons for anti xeno ?

Some are considered cheat from pro-AX pilots.
Meowers
05 Oct 2022, 8:00am
Modshards are extremely funny yet don't give you any nonsense-level powers.
Mac4
06 Oct 2022, 4:46am
Mac4e-breach on controller


Did find a thread on it on the official forums; a solution is to disable context menu in the on-foot options (under on-foot miscellaneous). You will lose the sub-menu, but no great harm done, so far. Can confirm it works.

Someone else there mentions rebinding to LB, but since this controls throttle down in flight mode, not sure how that would pan out.

Meanwhile, got sent on another restore mission that on a first go didn't register. I suppose it's nice you get to rob the place a second time, except... it really isn't
RearAdmiralPants
06 Oct 2022, 6:42am
I don't know what I'm missing when it comes to these on-foot covert missions. I know the refrain is "Disable the alarms, disable the alarms," but in order to do that I need to steal security credentials, and from the moment I do THAT, I can't get scanned. And there sure is security presence in the command building where the alarm controls are. So... what's the secret? I guess I have to subject myself to more mind-numbing youtube footage.

RE: The carrier jump / strange sounds videos I posted (see Reddit thread), another user posted a spectrogram and also found audio from an FC jump from 2020 and posted a spectrogram of that (he links to them on imgur, where if you click on them you get a higher resolution image as well as the ability to play some of them). While the moans I mention are present in the 2020 audio and spectrogram, they are at ~-60dB compared to my recording. So someone at FDev has definitely at the very least adjusted the equalization of the FC jump sounds - whether that's Thargoid related, who knows; I have no proof either way. But the two sound vastly different, IMHO. The thread with the spectro analysis is getting quite long, but you can read it if you're interested. I plan on noise gating both samples to isolate certain features of the spectrograms (because some of the folks are fighting me on basic physics of sound stuff I learned my freshman year of college - I'm a professional classically trained dramatic tenor when I'm not doing IT work) to prove to everyone what each feature actually is, but that's not going to get us anywhere in terms of saying "This is because Thargoids." I don't think we have the data to definitively say yes or no to that question. But it's an... interesting/odd change to make.
Sir-Duke
06 Oct 2022, 7:39am
RearAdmiralPantsSo... what's the secret?


Don't worry, after a while, you'll get used to some Odyssey mechanics.
It's not as immersive and deep as maybe classic splinter cell, or something, but it's doable.

First tip; after a security scan, you have about a minute or so, before the next guard might get interested in you.

How I do take out the alarms?
I secretely cut open a door towards the building with the alarms.
Just entering usually is no crime.
Then I search for somebody with high clearance.
It might take a minute, to plan the time between your last security scan and the quick stealing of the enemies identity.
Then, with a higher clearance, I rush towards the alarm panel, turn it off...
The rest is brute force.
Kurakil
06 Oct 2022, 9:38am
Certain settlement layouts are much more difficult than others. There is one agricultural layout where you have to go through almost the entire building consisting of agricultural areas, labs (all of which are restricted), corridors with guards, then finally you make it to the power area where the alarm console is. Most other layouts have separate buildings for everything so it's not too bad. Sometimes it really is impossible without killing someone, but most of the time there is a way. Getting fancy with jumping and crouching, creating an explosive distraction, dropping your clearance when they scan you only to get it right back when they turn around, etc. There is some room for creativity even with the limited gameplay elements. Sometimes you just have to dash in and turn the alarms off before they can react to you. The choice may come down to fines or bounties. Not saying it's fun, but it is doable.
Quillmonkey
07 Oct 2022, 7:46am
A silenced weapon and rooftop approach works well. Scan thru a window, check terminal for alarm location, enter building. Get to alarms and disable. You may be shot at but you’ll have plenty of time. Then it’s kill everyone for all mission types except non-violent.
RearAdmiralPants
07 Oct 2022, 9:21am
QuillmonkeyA silenced weapon and rooftop approach works well.


Yeah, I've resigned myself to just not bother anymore until I've engineered myself to be more silent.

Unfortunately I may have shot myself in the foot a bit - my Manticore Tormentor is upgraded to grade 5, but already has faster handling, reload speed, and magazine size. So I've got one more mod slot; I can't get both the indoor and outdoor ("simulated..." ye gods, FDev, couldn't you come up with something better?) mods unless something's changed since last I studied up on engineering and you can un-mod mods now. Faster handling came with the gun (I got it at level 3) as well as possibly reload speed. I have a few other tormentors at grade >1 (I think I have one at grade 3) but none at 4 or 5, so it will be even more of a grind if I have to toss this one.

My current other weapon is a grade 4 oppressor, but I'm not married to it; it has no mods at this time. Unlocking engineers was just getting too frustrating that I stopped.

My suit is at grade 4, and it has faster shield regen and extra backpack capacity, so I can add the silence mod on my suit (if it's worth it -- ?) plus one more once I get it up to G5.

I know many people recommend getting the unpressurized/"simulated" silenced weapon mod, since you can always vent a building's atmosphere, either from the console or the emergency control on the roof. So that's probably the route I will go, if/when I can unlock a damn engineer that will sell one to me. No idea what to do on the oppressor or the final two suit mods though.
User167261
07 Oct 2022, 11:00am
I would put the Noise Suppressor (indoor) mod on the Tormentor - it's a short range weapon so being silent outside works better on a rifle as you don't want to be close to the NPC - and on that I would put the Audio Masking mod (I have it on all of my rifles - but meta is to put it on the Executioner).

Audio Masking is probably a bit overrated unless you have it on the Executioner or the Shotty - i.e. weapons that can 1 shot kill an enemy (2 shots for shielded ones) - because as soon as they manage to return fire their weapon sound will alert other NPCs. The more bullet spongy NPCs will take just that little bit too long to whittle down with weaker weapons.

I have a G5 Oppressor with Audio Masking on it (came with it so I ran with it), while I find the weapon interesting even at G5 it still lacks the stopping power but we probably won't ever get a balance pass on it - honestly it's the worst weapon in terms of damage output (forum has a dedicated thread if you're into more detail). I only use it for messing around, not to be the most effective fwiw so if you want to focus on a good rifle without grinding too much re mats then don't do it on the Oppressor.

I have both silencer mods on a TK Zenith, tbh I find the outdoor one of limited use for it but it's more of a meme build than anything (as one of the mods was already preinstalled and I didn't know what else to fill the remaining slots with).

Last edit: 07 Oct 2022, 11:07am
RearAdmiralPants
08 Oct 2022, 5:26am
so if you want to focus on a good rifle


... Which would you recommend? I know my Manticore/stealth build will differ vastly from my CZ/Dominator build; that's a given. Honestly I have never pulled out any weapon but my Tormentor. Is a G5 Executioner really useful in covert missions? What do you do, put hip shot on it and rarely use the scope (since the only reason I would ever see for a long-range kill if you're attempting stealth is covert assassination)? I mean, at that point the four mods would be noise suppressor, audio masking, hip shot, and...?

Or just go for the shotgun?

Are quieter footsteps worth putting on the manticore?

I dunno. The grind gets boring quickly, and just burns up my morale if I spend an hour clearing a settlement and don't find a single thing I'm looking for. I don't even have most of the required engineers unlocked. I find myself wondering why I'm bothering - like, I'm grinding to be able to take my pick of on-foot missions and complete them successfully, but ... why? Other than rewards that fulfill the grind itself, there's nothing really worthwhile to completing them vs. ship missions.

Motivation has been a struggle all over my life lately - between entering middle age, the transformation of my social circle due to the pandemic, and various family health issues, "loss of affect" is the understatement of my lifetime to date.

Anyway, thanks for the tips. I just finished my Rear Admiral grind and got my Corvette two nights ago (having owned a Cutter since before carriers existed, and mining in an Anaconda), and the engineering comparison has been almost funny. I didn't have to gather a single material to engineer every single thing in my Corvette loadout to level five with the experimental effect I wanted. Compare that to my owning Odyssey since release... not quite the same experience.
User167261
08 Oct 2022, 6:04am
RearAdmiralPants
so if you want to focus on a good rifle



... Which would you recommend? I know my Manticore/stealth build will differ vastly from my CZ/Dominator build; that's a given. Honestly I have never pulled out any weapon but my Tormentor. Is a G5 Executioner really useful in covert missions? What do you do, put hip shot on it and rarely use the scope (since the only reason I would ever see for a long-range kill if you're attempting stealth is covert assassination)? I mean, at that point the four mods would be noise suppressor, audio masking, hip shot, and...?

Or just go for the shotgun?

Are quieter footsteps worth putting on the manticore?

I dunno. The grind gets boring quickly, and just burns up my morale if I spend an hour clearing a settlement and don't find a single thing I'm looking for. I don't even have most of the required engineers unlocked. I find myself wondering why I'm bothering - like, I'm grinding to be able to take my pick of on-foot missions and complete them successfully, but ... why? Other than rewards that fulfill the grind itself, there's nothing really worthwhile to completing them vs. ship missions.

Motivation has been a struggle all over my life lately - between entering middle age, the transformation of my social circle due to the pandemic, and various family health issues, "loss of affect" is the understatement of my lifetime to date.

Anyway, thanks for the tips. I just finished my Rear Admiral grind and got my Corvette two nights ago (having owned a Cutter since before carriers existed, and mining in an Anaconda), and the engineering comparison has been almost funny. I didn't have to gather a single material to engineer every single thing in my Corvette loadout to level five with the experimental effect I wanted. Compare that to my owning Odyssey since release... not quite the same experience.

Challenge of avoiding endless ranting about the shortcomings of Odyssey while providing useful advice accepted...

The shotgun even at G4 with scope (read up what it does, it's stupid and gamey and most likely a bug but it's very powerful in-game)and extra ammo is probably your best bet as while the laser and kinetic rifles are good later on, they still require switching due to the silly shield mechanic they lifted straight from the ship design.

Having grinded (and yes it was an unadulterated grind of about a month of non stop foot missions to unlock most engineers and G5 my 3 suits plus a handful of weapons) most weapons to G5 i feel like I've wasted my time, but my OCD makes me do silly things at times.

Even high CZs are very doable with G3 gear, and everything becomes so easy with G5 and noise mods that it gets boring quick. The only point of maxing gear is PvP (rare and I don't bother seeking it out, as the gameplay is antiquated Vs dedicated shooters), roflstomping CZs (a grind in a way in itself) and looting settlements faster. For me it was a weak sense of completionism I suppose but it's mostly done and it sure kept me busy.

There's a sour aftertaste to it though, because unlike ships there's nothing else to do with all that great gear apart from the aforementioned examples. I still love building, flying and engineering ships, even after 4500 hours.

Not getting the same satisfaction out of on foot gear, so my advice would be to dip into that content without going overboard, it's really not worth it unless you have literally nothing better to do.

The crux of the problem is that the on foot gameloop is very shallow - only reason to visit settlements on foot and do on foot missions is to get mats to improve your gear, to get mats a little bit easier. So they hid that behind repetition and really awful RNG (both in terms of drop rates but also worthless fluff mats to dilute the item pool) in order to artificially extend getting to the end game... Which is maxed gear but no game scenario where you really need it (high CZs could be it but balancing is all over the place both re credits and difficulty).

The base game doesn't suffer from this the same way because engineering is more nuanced, you have a wider variety of equipment in ships and outfitting and most importantly more activities to engage in. What else can you do on foot? Scanning plants and taking screenshots... No engineering needed for either.

Last edit: 08 Oct 2022, 7:05am
RearAdmiralPants
08 Oct 2022, 1:56pm
Scanning plants


This feature could have been such a tremendously powerful form of lore-revealer - I even have a mental model of how I would architect it, using horizontal scaling of users scanning the same biological resource as said resource scaled in difficulty to analyze, where the most difficult would unlock permits, or new tech broker recipes, or definitive lore... It could be SOOOOO much more than this tremendously lame tool that for some reason can only hold 1-3 samples of one species in it at a time, for which you get paid if you can find three differing samples of the same species (itself a dubious biological proposition), but exactly how much you will be paid is a big old question mark.

I know we've all heard this before. I bought Odyssey the day it came out. It's not as awful as a lot of people claim, but it's awful enough to spell the end of the Elite franchise (as in: they can take their option to stop updating the game two years after Odyssey's launch, which starts a clock where they must actively continue supporting it for two years before they may do as they please - including just turning off the API servers which, despite being a P2P game, would EOL the entire product in one flick of a switch (or click of a checkbox), which I very much suspect they will do - I would, anyway, if I had ... that for development resources.

Hopefully I'm wrong. Nothing's on the horizon that really compares. C'est la vie.

Thank you again for your help, and dealing with my cynical pessmisim.

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